A blown out primer in an AR.... What a Beeeaaaaach!

[Rmplstlskn]

Well I normally brag about the reliability of my Colt/Sabre carbine as AR's often get a deserved bad rap for not having ulta-reliability... but today I had a non-firearm failure that put my carbine out of the fight completely! A blown out primer! And yes, it was from a RELOAD too...



That little piece of brass locked up my AR tight! It must have blown out inside somewhere. When the new round got fed in, it must have got wedged in between the carrier and upper receiver on the other side of the ejection port. As soon as the round fired and the BC came back about 1/2", it LOCKED. It locked up tight!

The usual SOP is to use the charging handle to clear a malfunction, but it wasn't moving. We had to use a screwdriver in the ejection port as a pry bar to get the BC back about an inch. I was then able to use other areas of the BCG to pry back the BC about 2", enough to get the brass cartridge out and know it was not that as the problem. I then had to use a brass hammer and hit the BC back forward anmd that when the bits of brass primer came loose.

Fortunately no damage was done to receiver or BCG and I finished out the day with another few mags downrange on our steel and man on man practise session. What a PITA that little primer was...

It got me to wonder how an AK or FAL would have handled that blown primer...

Rmpl

[Matt In Oklahoma]

I have seen this at matches several times. The last one we had to tie 550 cord around the charging handle and pull while bumping the buttstock into the ground till the BC opened a little then we pryed it like you did. I have not seen an AK do it yet and when I looked into it one reason is we have 0 people reloading for theirs. It is very rare for factory to pop a primer or bust a case and leave trash in the works. Another oberservation is that it has been Colts or Custom Built with someones name rifles that have the most issues. The older sloppy rifles don't have as many issues and are not as hard to unlock. This is just an observation and nothing scientific just don't get bent and jump on a brother. LOL

[Lowdown3]

I've seen this problem before, I think it was factory ammo also IIRC. Got wedged under part of the fire control system and NOTHING could clear it.

It's like that really odd failure with certain "less expensive" (in other words cheap) AK's (Century's) wherein the spent cartridge ends up BEHIND the bolt carrier. I've seen that two times- once in a friend's and another time at Tactical Response. The gun did still function for a while though.

[groovy mike]

It got me to wonder how an AK or FAL would have handled that blown primer...

Rmpl

I have seen a blown primer lock up an FAL. This is one reason I do not own an FAL.
I have had blown primers in an AK. They rattle around until you dump them. They do NOT cause weapon failures.

Last week I was testing high pressure reloads in my SKS. I did this with the full knowledge that the loads were hot. I do not recommend this for others, it was my experiment and dangerous. At X grains of powder 8 out of 10 primers popped out of the cartridge cases. The SKS remained fully functional. The SKS is more accurate than the AK. This is the reason that I consider the lowly SKS a very good choice for SHTF.

[Spock]

there is an easy fix for that:



I know that response seems simplistic but it is. I trimmed the herd awhile back and settled on a QUALITY AK and an M1A selling off a low end AK i had and my AR-15. AKs are simple. its just they way they are. there aren't a metric ton load of nifty crap to buy for them to "enhance" the platform. you don't need to worry about the extractor insert color, the bolt carrier's special coating or if its staked, or some stupid chart with Xs on it.

there is a million and one arguments to be made against the AK but of them don't hold water.*

its inaccurate.

it is if you buy a cheap one. you wouldn't trust your life to an $500 oly plinker right? well don't buy a cheap quality AK either. I can shoot from a field position 4-5 moa with mine (sgl21-61). no bi pod, no pack just plain old prone position. I hit the 320 yard steel at our carbine match last month.

it has crappy sites. its the same sites that are on your hand gun. i actually find them easier to align than a peep sight system like that on my M1A. see argument 1.

the safety isn't ergonomic. no it isn't train more on it. I know the modern ar-15 training schools teach safety on when not firing even when doing a search and assess but you know what? keep your finger off the bang switch when not shooting. when I have to move from say prone to standing I'll throw my safety on then other wise I have it off and keep my finger off the trigger. oh the horror. its not any different then handling a glock,xd,sigma, MP pistol.

the mag release isn't ergonomic. no but its ambidextrous. its also the same kind thats on the FAL and M14.

mag changes are slower. yes they are but due to the AK's lack of bolt hold open very easy to practice dry. you practice clearing jams from your AR-15 right? you setup double feeds and stove pipes and stuck case clearance drills right? you spend that time practicing mag changes with an AK.

oh and there is no mistaking getting an AK's mag to lock into place. rock and hear the big click its in. no bang bang whoops my mag fell out because it wasn't seated crap.

ga the charging handle is on the right! again training the reloads. rock lock rack. its easy and you'll get faster.
like this guy:

can't mount optics. thats what Ultimaks, krebs rails, and texas weapons systems rails are for.

ammo is heavier. yes it is. it also chews up barricades better, like concrete and cars.

[Christian for Israel]

debris in the action will affect guns with enclosed receivers (AK, AR, FAL) more than open receivers (SKS, M1 Garand, M1 Carbine), that's just a fact of life. the tighter the tolerances in the enclosed action the more frequent problems will be. that is not to say any weapon is better than any other, it's just a mechanical fact. if your rifle has an enclosed receiver and tight tolerances it's going to lock up tight at some point (hopefully not when you need it most, but you know murphy...). the real question you need to ask yourself is, are you comfortable taking that chance?

[Bearman202]

Christian, I'm not, and that's why I sold the Colt AR-15. I had two split cases on it, using WOLF ammo, and realized that if that happened at a bad time, the bad time would get seriously worse. This was a matter of break the thing down and shove a rod through the barrel to get the old brass out. I don't know if it was a blown primer or what, but the last time it locked up on me, I had to take something and knock the charging handle back to clear it. After that, I sold the thing. The guy that bought it got some decent ammo and never had a problem. I cussed myself for just a second, then realized that I wanted something that would fire anything I could feed it. I now have a CETME. It's a LOT heavier, but it uses .308 vs. the .223, and it goes bang every time I pull the trigger. I just ordered a scope mount for it, and should have it this week. Of course, it's too freakin' cold to take it out right now, but I'm going to be ready for spring. Hey, if I HAD to do it, I would take it out right now, but I don't, so I'm not gonna. <G>

[Mikeg175]

I have a few Ar platform weapons , in .556/.223 and .308/7.62 , I have them in heavy barrel and in short barrel options . I throw a few thousand rounds a month through them and I have very little breakage/stoppage , unless I start shooting crap ammo ( and that is only on the .308's ) . I will toss them in the sand/mud/water wipe them quickly and then shoot them . I keep an ammo box with all the extra parts for them with me at all times . I then clean my weapons when I get home . I try to make them jam or break , I have found which clips work best with the individual guns and I buy a ton of them once I understand what works best .
What I like about the Ar platform is I can interchange my weapon parts with each other to try out different configurations . I have a Cobb Ar-10 that allows me to change the barrel/mag holder from .308 up to .338 or even smaller I assume , dont plan on that , so havent looked into it . I found with the few Ak's that I had that they very seldom had any problems either , no matter what the ammo , so was nice using cheap *** ammo , but the finish on them looked like a 12 year old made them . I also found that I had to work each and every mag to make them work right , with either filing something down or hitting it a certain way , so it was a pain , with my Ar's I just buy the mag's that work best and on most mags' the same brand will rock without any differences .
But no matter what weapon you choose , keep a supply of the parts that will break over time , you can order kits , that make it easy . You should also try and keep more then one weapon , if one breaks or goes down , you toss it away and bring the next one into play . I have at least 2 weapons that will take the same ammo , just for that reason and I should keep them on the same platforms , but I like the difference's ( at least with my handguns ) .
If I was in a Shtf scenario and was a massive shootout , I would think that knowing my weapons and knowing that at this point , Im only using the self defense ammo , that I would have very little chance of a malfunction and if I did , I would make the switch to my alternate weapon and either fallback to fix the problem or grab a second long gun , and if was a shootout type scenario , my handgun would probably be adequate for me to finish the fight . I shoot my handguns from 10ft to 50 yards to make sure I can hit the targets , now I don't have access to moving targets anymore , but I make sure I fire from all the positions and I am moving constantly , I dont use a rest and shoot like Im at a match .
So find the weapon you like , learn it , practice it . Check your local laws and go camping , have a friend set up some targets around camp, while your in tent , then have friend come in screaming , grab your guns and see what you can do in the dark and not knowing where he set them . We are thinking of trying this at night , but a little leery with the safety conditions , we want it safe , so sitting in tent , and coming out in daylight is ok , but we might try digging a safe hole for friend to crawl into and try it at night , but we need to make sure all the logistics are safe , also the local shooting after dark laws .

[Christian for Israel]

what i said above does not mean open receiver guns won't have problems and broken shells can happen in any gun. having the right tools on you to clear problems quickly is essential in a fight. that said, the closer the tolerances and the more places debris can hide, the more likely problems will result.