Questions

[Irish-Tech]

i built mine, but if your looking for a prebuilt and cheap you can look at rock river arms. There are others out there right now i just cant think of any names right now.

[Grand58742]

Best deal going when they have them in stock:

http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=LWR-C

And the BCM is a great rifle. I've dealt with Grant at G&R Tactical and he's good people. For uppers, I'd deal straight up with Bravo Company on those:

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/

Be prepared to go through a lot of different builds and types of rail systems lol. My personal favorites go towards the mid length gas system, but you really can't go wrong with a carbine length either. Personal choice overall and either will serve you fine.

You are going to want an optic at some point to add to the rifle. My 2 cents? Save up a little more and buy one straight up. I highly recommended Bravo Company and own one of the complete rifles myself. It is a quality build and will serve you fine. Plus, if you order the lower and upper separate, you miss out on the federal excise tax which takes a bit off the overall price. But you end up paying for what you get and frankly my first choice of Palmetto has gone down in quality recently and the Patrol Rifle is no longer available. Plus, it's hit or miss on whether or not you get a MPI/HPT bolt and barrel. So go for the gold and get a Colt or Bravo Company. Save money and buy a good optic like Aimpoint or EOTech and never look back.

Be wary of the Black Rifle Disease. It's hard to shake lol

[sully429]

a knoxx stock for your shotgun reduces recoil to a good point

[brokedownbiker]

I do appreciate all of the knowledge that is available on this site. It gives me the chance to learn from others mistakes or successes.
So I have more questions. This time it is about weapon choices. After reading one of the other posts I have chosen not to add another 22lr to my arsenal at this time. I am looking for something that my wife and children could be comfortable with shooting if they had to. Plus I want them to train with it. If it is not fun to shoot then training wont last long.
So my first question is in regards to 20 gauge shot guns. I have a single shot 12. This is way too much power for either my wife or kids. The wife can shoot it but does not like it. So what are peoples thoughts on the 20 gauge. There are lot of different factors to think of.
Does it have enough stopping power? Yes, it will, with the right ammunition, stop a deer (or any other mammal weighing 100-300 lbs. whether two or four legged)

How common are the rounds? Not as common as 12 ga. but with a little research you can find buckshot and slug loads thst will do the job well as well as plenty of bird loads

and I am sure others will come up with questions that I have not even thought of.
The next question is in regards to a MBR. I have been looking at 223 rounds. A lot of people recommend a 308. I am not against that idea, but would like to start swaging bullets in the future. I like the idea of being able to use the spent 22lr cases for bullet casings. Not a great reason, and would love others input. Another reason is the kick. I have not shot a 223 yet, but am assuming that the kick is not too bad. I have a 270 win hunting rifle and it is too heavy a kick for the family.

Is there much difference in kick between 223 and 308? That depends on the action, load and your sensitivity- If you want to commonize your ammunition for all members of the family I would recommend the .223, or at most the 7.62x39. The recoil in an AR or AK/SKS type of semi-automatic isn't going to be too much for the smaller folk and the round(s) is certainly capable of stopping an enemy

Thanks in advance for the replies. It is nice to know that there are people willing to help out someone who is clueless in these matter.

Listen to Grand and Matt, they won't steer ya wrong (just don't get them started rapping!!!)

[tarheelsman71]

If you are dead set on a .223 then this might interest you....I have shot one of these and they performed great, but it is a copy of a copy.

http://www.classicfirearms.com/long-guns/cetme-version

[Doc]

Thanks Tarheelsman, I will look into this further. I do like the looks of that. And the price seems reasonable.
Now Grand, I appreciate the link. But could you be more specific as to what I am looking for in the rifle. I am just clueless. Like you said better to buy once and be happy then to buy it and hate it. I want to be happy with my purchase as I am sure I wont be able to run out an buy a different one if I dont like it.
Thanks guys for all the help. I am wanting to know what to look for.

[Grand58742]

Okay, from front to back...

On an AR, gas system length is not important for the most part. It's more of a matter of preference. Carbine length or mid length will be fine.

You want a high pressure tested/magnetic particle inspected barrel (marked as HP/MP or MPI)

Twist ratio...typically your 1/7 twist will handle everything from 55 grains to 77 grains which is the range of ammo you should be looking at. 1/9 twist ratio is marginal at anything over 68 grains. Some will, some won't shoot heavy stuff accurately. Overall, given the choice between 1/7 and 1/9, go with 1/7 since it gives you more of a range of ammo choices if you so desire.

A 4150 mil-spec chrome-moly-vanadium steel barrel is good. Hammer forged barrels work great. The "machine gun steel" Palmetto uses is proprietary to FN USA, but is the same they use on the military issue M249s.

Flash hiders and muzzle brakes are a matter of personal choice. An A2 flash hider will serve you fine.

F marked front sight base (A frame). This ensures the iron sights align correctly. An A2 sight base will work, but the F marked is designed for a flat top receiver.

5.56mm or .223 Wylde chamber versus a .223 chamber. There is now some debate on whether or not a .223 chamber will be insufficient for 5.56, but frankly, why chance it? 5.56mm chambers are rated for higher pressure ammo and can safely shoot both 5.56 pressured ammo and .223 commercial ammo.

HP/MP bolt made of Carpenter 158 steel, shot peening is preferred. Carpenter 158 steel work hardens and shot peening takes the surface tension off the metal.

Properly staked gas key. Without staking (or proper staking) the gas key can be shot loose and you end up with a single shot rifle. Here's a picture of a proper staking job:



And one that isn't staked that well:



This is critical to ensure your rifle runs correctly.

M4 feed ramps...not necessarily a vital "must have" item, but cannot hurt. If it comes down to the choice between M4 feed ramps or not at the same price, go with the M4 feed ramps (helps in chambering)

You want forged upper and lower receivers. Personally the polymer lowers and whatnot have not stood up to the test of time yet. None of the companies that I am aware of have stayed in business even though they claim the polymer lowers are "just as tough" as the aluminum ones. New Frontier is the newest in a long line of companies that have made them. But look at metal versus plastic...overall, the polymer lowers are just not going to be as strong as a metal one. And some use proprietary parts making replacement difficult.

Chrome lining on gas key, chamber and prefer a chrome lined barrel. However, the S&W Melonite treatment seems to be good to go as well. Don't worry about NiB coatings or anything else until you know more about your rifle. Standard coatings will work just fine.

Full auto bolt carrier versus commercial AR bolt carrier. Neither has an "edge" over the other, however, the full auto bolt carrier (which is not a restricted item) is slightly heavier and soaks up a little recoil and slows down the system. Again, with the choice between the two, go full circle full auto bolt carrier.

Mil-Spec versus commercial receiver extensions (buffer tubes). Matter of debate as neither one are "stronger" than the other so to speak. However, you tend to get more stock options with a mil-spec receiver extension versus a commercial one. Stocks are a matter of personal preference.

Triggers are something you can get into after you end up shooting more. Go with the standard trigger to start and you'll be fine.

Back up iron sights (BUIS) are critical. Learn to use them since optics can and will fail. Type isn't as important so to speak, but Magpul makes good ones at decent prices.

Optics are a matter of debate, but Aimpoint are at the top of the food chain along with EOTech. The Aimpoint PRO is a good choice at a reasonable price.

Any other questions, let me know or shoot me a PM.

[Doc]

Thanks Grand. That was very informative. I am leaning toward just getting the money together and going with your suggestion of the PSA M4A1. We will see what happens in the next couple of weeks. Thanks again.