Bug Out Weapons

[firemike82]

To start, here is an inventory of my firearms on hand:

9mm xd9 sc -mine
sw bodyguard in .38-wife
2 12ga shotguns
2 20ga shotguns
1 16 ga shotgun
1 remington 700 in .308

My wife and I live in a highly populated area, and out bug out plan is to move quick and light to our bug out location in lightly populated area between Texas and Oklahoma. My plan is to stash several of my shotguns at our bug out location, and then each of us carry a primary and secondary firearm when we bug out. Our bug out route takes about an hour by truck, and roughly 3 days on foot. Most of the trip is through sparsely populated farm land, but unfortunately the first 20 min/1 day of the trip is highly populated.

My initial thought was that i would man the .308 while my wife carried a shotgun, and if necessary we could stop and post up in a defensive position while en route to our bug out location. But we have recently had a child and that brings up my questions.

Will my .308 be an adequate medium/long range firearm for a quick/light bug out, or am I going to need to upgrade to a carbine. My primary concern is rounds down range/reload time, especially with that fact that while my wife will be on a shotgun, she will also have a baby to deal with. My wife is semi-supportive of my prepping, but I dont know if she will go for a carbine purchase. Another thing is that with my bug out location I dont necessarily think I would need the carbine, and woulud rather invest that money in more ammo.

Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated!

[Patriot Prepper]

I agree that you need a carbine or a main battle rifle. The shotguns are great, but as you know, have limited range. A main battle rifle with a 30 round or higher mag would give you more firepower.

I love the AR platform, but AKs also are excellent choices. I use the AR 15 and also AR platform semi-autos chambered in .308 Win/7.62 Nato. If you have a .308 win the AR platform or a FAL, chambered in .308 may be an option. Howerver, keep in mind that the AR 15 in 5.56 offers advantages for CQC over the .308 win. The .308 may over penetrate at close range. It also has more recoil and is harder to take follow up shots. The ammo, as you know is also heavier than the .308 win.

Some of the guns I use include: 9mm, and .45 handguns, 12 gauge shotguns, AR 15s, AR platform .308s, .308 bolt actions, .338 LM bolt actions, and .50 BMG bolt actions. Most of the guns are at my retreat. If I were in a bug out situation, the AR 15 and my .45 would be my bug out guns.

The AR 15 is light, accurate, easy to point and shoot, and is a meat grinder at close range. The ammo is so light that I often think a box is empty.

[610Alpha]

From your list I noticed that you had 1 16 ga. shotgun, however the other gauges had 2. Assuming the pair of 12 ga and 20 ga are the same brand/model etc they serve as backup parts. Since you only have 1 16 ga, I would sell it and put that money towards the purchase of an AR/AK. 16 ga ammo isn't as common as 12 and 20 ga. unless you go to a big gun store, most wally worlds and smaller stores don't carry 16 ga. ammo, which in my mind is another reason to sell it.

just my opinion.

[Patriot Prepper]

From your list I noticed that you had 1 16 ga. shotgun, however the other gauges had 2. Assuming the pair of 12 ga and 20 ga are the same brand/model etc they serve as backup parts. Since you only have 1 16 ga, I would sell it and put that money towards the purchase of an AR/AK. 16 ga ammo isn't as common as 12 and 20 ga. unless you go to a big gun store, most wally worlds and smaller stores don't carry 16 ga. ammo, which in my mind is another reason to sell it.

just my opinion.

I agree. The 16 gauge is an odd caliber. Even the 20 gauge ammo is harder to find than the 12 gauge. We have some 20 gauge shotguns for the ladies and I hate locating ammo for them - less options on buck and slugs unless I search for it. I wish we only had 12 gauges.

Too many calibers makes life more complex. I also believe you really NEED the main battle rifle. Elittle is right, sell the 16 gauge and buy the AR/AK.

[firemike82]

The two 12's are both pump remington 870's, but the 20's are browning semi-autos(not ideal). The 16ga is a heirloom from my grandfather that passed away, so I'm gonna hang on to it for sentimental value. I have stripped and cleaned it though and it is good working order so I just keep a case of shells of shells for bird duty. I've got the bulk of my shotgun ammo in 12ga in both OO and slugs with a case of shells for fowl. A carbine is definately on my list of wants, but to appease my wife its probably a little farther down the list than I would like. Thanks for your input though.

From your list I noticed that you had 1 16 ga. shotgun, however the other gauges had 2. Assuming the pair of 12 ga and 20 ga are the same brand/model etc they serve as backup parts. Since you only have 1 16 ga, I would sell it and put that money towards the purchase of an AR/AK. 16 ga ammo isn't as common as 12 and 20 ga. unless you go to a big gun store, most wally worlds and smaller stores don't carry 16 ga. ammo, which in my mind is another reason to sell it.

just my opinion.

[610Alpha]

The 16ga is a heirloom from my grandfather that passed away, so I'm gonna hang on to it for sentimental value.

I can certainly understand that. You say that the bulk of your ammo is in 12 ga...any reason you are keeping the 20's? Does your wife shoot the 12ga? Maybe add a butt pad to the 12's to help with recoil for her. If you can stand getting rid of one of the pairs of shotguns you could use that money. Just a thought.

[MustangGal]

Has your wife read "One Second After"? Before we had our son, I was a police officer. It didn't bother me, at all, to go into tough situations - I loved the adrenaline rush. Having the man cub changed me - PROFOUNDLY. I quit law enfocement, because he needed me. DH and I love each other, but this was a different feeling alltogether. I have this fierce need to protect him in any way I can. Last spring, as a part of my Comp I class, I HAD to read "One Second After." It is not my kind of book. I like sci/fi fantasy escapism - pure entertainment. This book made me face the fact that there are possible situations that could leave me telling my son there was nothing if he asked for something to eat - unless I took steps to prepare. We had been snowed in earlier that winter and DH read it before I did, so he understood where I was coming from - even if he wasn't completely on board. Fortunately, because of our LEO careers, we were pretty well set in the way of firepower. Plus, I love guns and shooting, so it wouldn't be too hard to convince me we needed another. lol

Sorry for the ramble, but a book like "One Second After" might change your wife's mindset - particularly in light of the new family member. I don't think my fierce need to protect my son is unique to me. I think it is something most mothers feel. It is why we wake up in the night and check to make sure they are breathing and comfortable - even when they are seven.... I don't know about after seven... yet. :)

[firemike82]

I would love to add a Carbine to the arsenal, but I'm fairly green to prepping and my wife thinks the carbine is a little over the top at the moment. I'm chipping away at her, but i'll take some time.

As for ammo I do like the .223 as well for carbine ammo, and you can buy it relatively cheap in bulk. I do worry about starting to diversify my ammo too much though, and would probably stick with the .308 so that I can use it in more than one weapon. I think I could live with over penetration in the .308 as I would most likely go with a shotgun indoors anyway.

I do really like the .45 in a handgun, but its a little too much for my wife to handle and I want her to be able to pick up and shoot whatever is available. I also am really trying to keep to just a few calibers to try and not spread my ammo too thin. She is pretty comfortable with the .38, and with a revolver there isnt much to think about. I recently helped my father in law pick out his first handgun, and I of course was pushing for 9mm so we could stockpile/share ammo. One of his friends had him conviced though that the 9mm is not manly enough, and he got a .40. I tried to tell him to go ahead and get a .45 in that case, but he already had is mind made up. The .40 is a good caliber in theory, but it's just got too much snap and it's not as smooth as a .45 in my opinion.

Thanks for your adivce

I agree that you need a carbine or a main battle rifle. The shotguns are great, but as you know, have limited range. A main battle rifle with a 30 round or higher mag would give you more firepower.

I love the AR platform, but AKs also are excellent choices. I use the AR 15 and also AR platform semi-autos chambered in .308 Win/7.62 Nato. If you have a .308 win the AR platform or a FAL, chambered in .308 may be an option. Howerver, keep in mind that the AR 15 in 5.56 offers advantages for CQC over the .308 win. The .308 may over penetrate at close range. It also has more recoil and is harder to take follow up shots. The ammo, as you know is also heavier than the .308 win.

Some of the guns I use include: 9mm, and .45 handguns, 12 gauge shotguns, AR 15s, AR platform .308s, .308 bolt actions, .338 LM bolt actions, and .50 BMG bolt actions. Most of the guns are at my retreat. If I were in a bug out situation, the AR 15 and my .45 would be my bug out guns.

The AR 15 is light, accurate, easy to point and shoot, and is a meat grinder at close range. The ammo is so light that I often think a box is empty.

[firemike82]

Actually neither of us has read that yet. I have heard it is very good though. My wife has actually been making some progress on the acceptance of me prepping, I think she worries I will just get out of control with it. Most of my preps are dual purpose so I can use them when I go hunting or camping, so I think she is seeing that in the grand scheme of things I am just trying to protect my family.

Has your wife read "One Second After"? Before we had our son, I was a police officer. It didn't bother me, at all, to go into tough situations - I loved the adrenaline rush. Having the man cub changed me - PROFOUNDLY. I quit law enfocement, because he needed me. DH and I love each other, but this was a different feeling alltogether. I have this fierce need to protect him in any way I can. Last spring, as a part of my Comp I class, I HAD to read "One Second After." It is not my kind of book. I like sci/fi fantasy escapism - pure entertainment. This book made me face the fact that there are possible situations that could leave me telling my son there was nothing if he asked for something to eat - unless I took steps to prepare. We had been snowed in earlier that winter and DH read it before I did, so he understood where I was coming from - even if he wasn't completely on board. Fortunately, because of our LEO careers, we were pretty well set in the way of firepower. Plus, I love guns and shooting, so it wouldn't be too hard to convince me we needed another. lol

Sorry for the ramble, but a book like "One Second After" might change your wife's mindset - particularly in light of the new family member. I don't think my fierce need to protect my son is unique to me. I think it is something most mothers feel. It is why we wake up in the night and check to make sure they are breathing and comfortable - even when they are seven.... I don't know about after seven... yet. :)

[firemike82]

I use the 20's for phesant/quail hunting so I like to keep those around. Also my inlaws have little experience with guns, and I think people new to shotguns are a little more comfortable with 20ga, especially semi-auto. My wife actually prefers the 12ga pump out of all my guns even though its a little big. I'm thinking I might do a foregrip, stock, and possibly barrel swap though to make one of them a little more tactical.

I can certainly understand that. You say that the bulk of your ammo is in 12 ga...any reason you are keeping the 20's? Does your wife shoot the 12ga? Maybe add a butt pad to the 12's to help with recoil for her. If you can stand getting rid of one of the pairs of shotguns you could use that money. Just a thought.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

slugs in both the 20 and 12 are good out to 200yds IF you practice and while they may not be tack drivers it will buy you time to reload

your need for a carbine/MBR is needed somewhat depending on the situation although I made it many years without one. You say there is no need once you get there but I find that hard to believe. What would you leave your wife with? Why not have 2 weapons that can reach out? 2 is 1 etc
The firepower you listed is more than you can hand carry so i would trim it down IMO

[deijoe]

What about a .22 caliber rifle, like a 10/22. So, once you are out there at your bog out location, you can do a little hunting....
Plus 22s are cheap, and a good learners weapon..

[firemike82]

I havent practiced with slugs at distance, but that needs to be something on my to do list.

I guess I shouldnt say no need for a Carbine, but I feel like I could possibly get away with out one. I would stash all my extra weapons and ammo at my bug out location other than a primary and secondary firearm for my wife and I. Once there the terrain is fairly inaccesible other than the primary interance. With that acces point I have line of site at rought 1,000 yards, with a choke point at about 700ish yards. I am a fairly good shot with my rifle, and at that distance I can get a fair amount of rounds on target before they get close enough to switch to the Carbine. I'm sure if they were to progress close enough a carbine would be nice, but I would be firing from an elevated position so I could "probably" get by on the hail of shotgun fire from above as a deterrent.

Dont get me wrong, I would love to add 2 Carbines and a significant amount of ammo to my armory, but for the time being I'm feeling like I need to invest more on long term food storage and things of that nature.

Thanks for the advice

slugs in both the 20 and 12 are good out to 200yds IF you practice and while they may not be tack drivers it will buy you time to reload

your need for a carbine/MBR is needed somewhat depending on the situation although I made it many years without one. You say there is no need once you get there but I find that hard to believe. What would you leave your wife with? Why not have 2 weapons that can reach out? 2 is 1 etc
The firepower you listed is more than you can hand carry so i would trim it down IMO

[kihnspiracy]

I would ditch the .20ga shotguns. Pick one type pistol that you and your wife can shoot. Glock, XD, Sig, etc. Stick with that and have duplicates for you and her. That way you have the same mags, holsters. Get 2 rifles of the same type. AR, AK, etc.

[Patriot Prepper]

I guess I shouldnt say no need for a Carbine, but I feel like I could possibly get away with out one. I would stash all my extra weapons and ammo at my bug out location other than a primary and secondary firearm for my wife and I. Once there the terrain is fairly inaccesible other than the primary interance. With that acces point I have line of site at rought 1,000 yards, with a choke point at about 700ish yards. I am a fairly good shot with my rifle, and at that distance I can get a fair amount of rounds on target before they get close enough to switch to the Carbine. I'm sure if they were to progress close enough a carbine would be nice, but I would be firing from an elevated position so I could "probably" get by on the hail of shotgun fire from above as a deterrent.

Dont get me wrong, I would love to add 2 Carbines and a significant amount of ammo to my armory, but for the time being I'm feeling like I need to invest more on long term food storage and things of that nature.

Thanks for the advice

I also would prefer to fire from a distance and practice long range precision shooting. That's why I own several .308 win, .338 LM, and .50 BMG rifles. Distance is great. However, when bugging out, you are usually in route to your bug out destination. Under those conditions, you will encounter threats at close range. A carbine is the best choice for close to medium range threats - massive firepower and very light. Beats pistol, shotgun, etc. (Pistols have limited range and power. Love them and shotguns. But even shotguns are limited, even with buck and slugs. Plus they are not as easy to use as a carbine. With a carbine you can lay down massive amounts of rounds - 30 to 60 round mags or 100 round drums. No recoil and accurate.

Also note that, even at your retreat, there could be multiple threats that get past your observation point, and come in close. I believe the carbine will then be your best choice.

A main battle rifle is not a - luxury item. it's a necessity. A must have tool. Extremely useful. I would choose it over food and other gear for the time being (unless you don't have much food). I am only suggesting that you real consider getting a main battle rifle. Think of the military, what do all the troops carry? A main battle rifle. There's for a reason for that.