Shotgun ammunition

[rice paddy daddy]

To each their own, but I have never have understood that. I wouldn't want a defense load that won't go through walls, furnture, floor and roof. I darn well WANT to kill whatever I am shooting at no matter what it is trying to hide behind.

Amen, Brother!! If I ever have to shoot someone, I want to blow a very big hole clear thru the perp. Big enough to drive a Buick thru.

[rice paddy daddy]

If you live in Florida, check state law before ordering any shells from the list posted by Klayton. Many are not legal here.

[groovy mike]

I was referring to over penetration.

To each their own, but I have never have understood that. I wouldn't want a defense load that won't go through walls, furnture, floor and roof. I darn well WANT to kill whatever I am shooting at no matter what it is trying to hide behind.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

sounds like a well thought out plan

[LizardKing]

I read a bunch of ballistic studies before I settled on #1 buck for my semi auto (more total mass going downrange at a higher velocity). The only problem is that it's tough to get except at the end of the year. I thought about the progressive route, upping the power each round or so, but then I have to keep track and there's a potential legal issue there. After the birdshot don't do the trick and you fire the 00, then it's intentional with forethought. If they're all the same, then it's the stress of the situation when you empty the tube. Just something I read a while back. That said, the side saddle has slugs in it for quick use if needed.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

Yep anything with a larger ball may overpenetrate even when mixed with smaller shot.
For the drywall and flower decor of suburbia I would stick with smaller shot that progressively gets larger in the tube so that if a #8 and a #6 don't work the next one being a #2 makes a nastier hole and then if zombie won't die or you find he has friends and it has gotten serious the following 00 takes care of that in shorter order and if he makes it to a car or cover the last shots being slugs help solve the issue.
Just a thought

[Longhunter]

Not sure how you could have "too much" for home defense.

I was referring to over penetration. I'm currently stuck in suburbia.

I've tried some of the 410 loads for the judge and they work well within 10 yards.

[groovy mike]

Does anyone have any experience with "buck and ball" loads? It seems to be based on the buck and ball load of the smoothbore musket days. The modern loads I've seen are 1 .65 ball and 6 pieces of #1 shot per shell, or some slight variation of that. Seems like it could be worth checking out, I think definately too much for home defense though.

Not sure how you could have "too much" for home defense.

There is a company marketing similar loads specifically for home defense. I think they are intended for 410 shotshells in the Taurus Judge revolver. Seem like a very efefctive answer to threats within a 10 yard range.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

I used to handload some with 3 OO and # 2s, #6s thrown in, for an all purpose type load when i was younger. It's legality on hunting was why I quit messing with it but for survival and the not having to change a load out I think it would be good. It had the ability to take out anything within short ranges.

[Longhunter]

Does anyone have any experience with "buck and ball" loads? It seems to be based on the buck and ball load of the smoothbore musket days. The modern loads I've seen are 1 .65 ball and 6 pieces of #1 shot per shell, or some slight variation of that. Seems like it could be worth checking out, I think definately too much for home defense though.

[Klayton]

OH, not sure why they didn't list them, but there are also "sabot" rounds, for a little longer range... =)

[Klayton]

But since I love shotguns I thought I would add some 411 for those that also like shotguns. =)

Avenger: Hollow steel balls with a low gunpowder load. Short range and low recoil, with low penetration. Could be useful in a situation requiring low penetration, such as home defense. Semi-nonlethal.
Bird Bombs: An explosive payload, which (in theory) detonates on impact. Roughly equivalent to an m80 firecracker.
Bolo: Two heavy slugs connected by piano wire. Was once known as the garrote slug. While impossible to aim, the wire becomes a very hazardous blade at muzzle velocity.
Bouncer: Two zytel (nylon) balls. High muzzle velocity, very low penetration. Semi-nonlethal, like rubber bullets.
Chain reaction: A 6-inch length of chain. Impacts in a rather random pattern.
Comet: A regular shotgun slug with a red tracer.
Detonator: Essentially, a hollow lead slug with an explosive tip. It's made with for the purpose of filling with your own explosive or other payload, which then detonates on impact.
Door buster: Tiny lead pellets, approaching lead dust. Impacts with full force, but over a larger area, with very little penetration.
Dragon's Breath: Yes, these really do exist, and yes, you can order them for $16.98 each. White phosphorous that ignites upon being shot. Creates a 100-yard flamethrower that burns for about three seconds. Contrary to popular belief, this does not damage a smooth-bore shotgun.
Fire siren: A small weighted whistle. Incredibly loud at muzzle velocity. Wear ear protection.
Flash bomb: Like the bird bomb, above, but using a flash-powder incendiary instead of an explosive one.
Flechette: A whole bunch of needles. High penetration.
Hammer: A bean-bag round; a nylon bag filled with tiny shot. High impact, but theoretically nonlethal.
Mini Missile: A solid lead slug with a steel core. The lead slug peels away on impact, driving the core through hard targets (like armor.)
Napalm: Like the Bird Bomb, above, but filled with white phosphorous, which burns very hot upon impact.
Pit Bull: Six big lead pelletes, and one big slug. Not that exotic, really.
Shredder: A lot of sharp tacks. Short range, but high trauma to flesh.
Smoke bomb: Essentially, the Dragon's Breath Round, only using a smoke powder instead.
Stinger: 16 zytel (nylon) balls. Essentially, the rubber bullet for shotguns. Semi-nonlethal.
Super flare: A shotgun-launched flare.

Website I buy some shotgun specialty ammo from: http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/index....specialty-ammo
Sometimes they have some "Dragon's Breath" rounds and flachette rounds, but charge a good penny for them.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

96thTallarn Thats the ones. I forgot they were like 2in and the european ones are 2 1/2. Great clarification.

[96thTallarn]

I'm not sure if the shells I have are the ones that Matt is thinking of, but what I have are from Aguila. They are called Minishells. They make a slug round and a multi shot round with #7 shot and one 0 Buck, think they also make shells only loaded with #7. They shells are 1 3/8" long. They will feed out of a Winchester 1300/Defender. I can fit 12 in a standard full length magazine tube (not the 5 round length). I didn't do anything to make them run through my Winchester, they will not feed properly through an unmodified Remington 870. I have never tried to feed them through a Mossberg. They have minimal recoil but still hit pretty hard, especially the slugs. I don't know if they still make them or not however I still see them at gun shows from time to time.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

The 3 1/2 has 18 OO PELLETS and is a shoulder full!
ELITTLE is absolutly correct on lower recoiling shells. I killed everything that walked, crawled or flew with a short 20ga long before I got my 12ga 3 1/2.
Try them all and use what is tolerable. There are some cheap 2 1/2 mexican/european shells out there that may or may not work in a pump. They will not feed in our autos, to the best of my knowledge anyway.