Raising cattle for income?

[Lowdown3]

I know we have a few folks here on the forums in the SE that raise cattle. Wonder if they would chime in on any of this. Suggestions from all requested.

We will be acquiring some more land that will be used as pasture here soon and I'm thinking long term towards retirement. Figure roughly 50 acres total, perhaps more later after some timber is sold and that area cleaned up.

Looking more as a supplement income stream during retirement.

The area grows grass well, but it doesn't stand out as a higher quality grass. Would like to introduce a better pasture grass- suggestions.

What could one expect (ballpark) for a cow/calf operation on roughly that size land? I realize their is a boatload of factors going into this.

Would a cow/calf deal be the best option or if not, what then?

Newbie to cattle here. Appreciate any suggestions, TIA

[eeyore]

I had a friend, he has gone on to his reward, recent. He raised a beef a year for his freezer every year. It was totally on grass, no grain at all. So that can be done on only grass. My friend raised a long horn mix, basically mixed with what ever type of bull that was available when he needed the cow to be serviced.

I guess I would be interested in, if you had a type (short horn, long horn, miniature, bison, beefalo, or what type you were going to try to raise. I have no personal experience either, just curious.

[610Alpha]

Recommendations

I would encourage you to look into Silvopasture (Cattle & Trees) and check out Mark Shepard, Darren Doherty, Allan Savory, Joel Salatin (Salad Bar Beef book), and Greg Judy to name a few.

http://www.permaculturevoices.com/po...g-judy-pvp045/ Videos at the bottom of this page at Mark's site.


U of I is doing research based on Mark's system: http://wppresearch.org/ - I don't think they are including animals in their research.


http://www.greenpasturesfarm.net/ Greg Judy - I would check out his books. I heard him talk about the color of your cattle makes a difference. On hot sunny days black cattle are sitting under the shade while white cattle our out eating, you want the cattle to be eating. I also heard him mention to always stand to one specific side of the cattle so that you can watch for a triangular area that will tell you the cattles gut fill and what it should look like. He also talks about the height of cattle and how that is important.

http://www.permaculturevoices.com/holistic-management/permaculture-voices-podcast-012-building-soil-healing-the-land-and-raising-high-quality-food-with-rotational-grazing/

http://holisticmanagement.org

http://holisticmanagement.org/downloads/intro_HM.zip

http://holisticmanagement.org/downloads/financial_planning.zip

http://holisticmanagement.org/downloads/grazing_planning.zip

http://www.permaculturevoices.com/po...hepard-pvp039/ -- You can go to geofflawton.com and see a recent video of Mark talking to Geoff about his setup in Wisconsin...http://www.geofflawton.com/fe/74613-...ure-for-profit Yes he asks for your email but he doesn't spam you.

You can learn alot from these free resources and you can find their books in libraries.

If you want to learn more about Silvopasture go here: http://www.centerforagroforestry.org/practices/sp.php


Well that should give anyone information over load. It does me.

[1Admin]

Thanks everyone.

We raised a calf for meat years and years ago, all on grass. It certainly wasn't as "tender" as store bought, but it was good nevertheless.

[610Alpha]

Thanks everyone.

We raised a calf for meat years and years ago, all on grass. It certainly wasn't as "tender" as store bought, but it was good nevertheless.

I remember reading in one of Joel Salatin's books about this. Grain Fed cattle have a layer of fat over the meat that grass fed cattle do not. During the cool down process that layer of fat protects the meat and allows it to tenderize. If grass fed meat is allowed a longer cool down time it would be just as tender is what he said.

It might have been in "Everything I want to do is illegal" where he talks about this.

[justanothergunnut]

ive never butchered cattle but meat is meat. Get the blood out of the meat by hanging and LET IT HANG a day or two. Deer benefits from hanging so I see no reason why beef would be any different. Isnt that what aging is??

[610Alpha]

ive never butchered cattle but meat is meat. Get the blood out of the meat by hanging and LET IT HANG a day or two. Deer benefits from hanging so I see no reason why beef would be any different. Isnt that what aging is??

Most Beef butchering facilities have to follow USDA (or as Joel calls them US Duh) regulations on how fast they have to cool the meat.

How much fat does deer have on it? Not much it is very lean. Letting it hang at ambient temperature has a different effect on the meat and its tenderness is my understanding.

Your typical hunter that processes his deer lets it hang a day or two and not at the required USDA temperature.

I highly recommend Joel Salatin's book "Everything I want to do is Illegal". We all know the gubmint does some stupid crap and make rules/regs just for the sake of having them.

[Rmplstlskn]

Joel Salatin is a local superstar around these parts of Virginia... Quite the entertaining advocate. And from my experience with those who raise grass-fed beef, yes, the aging is the most important part to tender beef. It is an art or calculation, and the processors that get it right are always busy.

My neighbor is retired and raises cattle, but he does it more for the grass EATING than the money, as he doesn't have to bushhog his fields, he just lets the cattle mow his grass, and fertilize it. He buys them as young cattle and then sells them in the fall. I don't think he makes a lot doing it, but beef prices are now high, so that may change. He also does his own castrations and other vet tasks. Gotta factor in a big, strong trailer for them as well.

That is the extent of what I know...

Rmpl

[protus]

Yip proper aging is one key to "tenderness ". Also how you prepare /cook it.
Cook a London broil the same way you do a blade roast and watch...
Deer OS the same way. In my experience we never hang our deer. 1- well its normally in the 80 s still...so that wont work. What we do is butcher..then if I wish to cook we let it rest 2-4 days in the fridge and drain as needed.
Aging beef is no different ....you need a cold dry environment. There's a good series on one of the food channels that showed all of this.
That said 1/2 slabs are near that 4-600$ mark last I checked down here.

As to breeds...there's a long horn..(x) mix that was bred for Floridas high heat etc...still raised today. They are not hurt by temp swings etc and super sturdy ...ill try and find the breed.

[Benn Gleck]

Protus, My cousin used to raise cattle in the Indian River area of Florida and most of his cattle were Brangus s/p? It was a cross between Brahma and Black Angus. He said he liked the heat tolerance and marbleing of the meat.

[MustangGal]

Here in the Ozarks, you can typically figure one to two acres per cow/calf pair. Where my cousin lives in CO it is 10 to 20. Are you going to need hay? If so, do you plan to buy or raise?

[motesjm]

Excluding fixed cost, infrastructure, equipment, ect...20 good cows and a good bull can net about $350/head year over year. If you have good pastures and 50 acres figure on about 1.5 acres per cow/calf. That's with you buying hay for the winter.

Don't worry about the breed too much. You just want something that will wean early and put on weight before market. I prefer a large frame cow like a Santa Gertrudis bred to an Angus, which is a smaller bull that has an excellent meat to bone ratio. Calving is easier on the cow and the calves weight up in a hurry.

You're not going to get rich with 50 acres, but cows are a little extra income and just plain enjoyable. Having a few thousand pounds of preps on the hoof doesn't hurt my feelings either.