Need some hard data

[1Admin]

For a friend who's looking to attempt to combat some of the MSM's brainwashing.

So we know that many of if not all of the big time active shooter deals involve people on depression type meds, etc.

I need a source of hard data, something no one or few could dispute, that shows some or all of the big time active shooter personnas and that they were on psychotrophic (sp?? Med folks, if I'm misspelling that word please let me know.)

We need to start combating the "guns are bad but meds are ok" line of thinking.

Any info appreciated.

[Triple-sod]

That makes for pretty interesting reading

http://www.kmr.nu/artikel_psychiatric_drugs_cause_violence.pdf

Columbine shooter was prescribed antidepressant

http://articles.cnn.com/1999-04-29/health/9904_29_luvox.explainer_1_antidepressant-ssris-drugs?_s=PM:HEALTH

Virginia Tech Aftermath: Did Legal Drugs Play a Role in the Massacre?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/virginia-tech-aftermath-d_b_46280.html

Mr. Loughner told her he wished he had taken the antidepressants he had once been prescribed

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/08/us/loughner-pleads-guilty-in-2011-tucson-shootings.html

(suppose that could be used to argue the opposite, although there’s plenty of evidence that suggests those who stop such drugs suffer from considerable ‘withdraw symptoms’)

[Grand58742]

Unfortunately, I don't think there will ever be a hard connection there, at least not reported or easy to find. And getting people to believe it even when facts stare them in the face? It's far easier for the MSM to blame the inanimate object in this case rather than the source of it all. Gun control is and has always been a left wing media toy and this time they have their crown jewel. You want to inflame a population, gun down a school full of kids. Ignore the fact the person was on medication, guns are bad. Just like the media ignored the facts of the Trayvon Martin situation and the facts he assaulted Zimmerman, twist the story to fit your agenda and put whatever or whomever you want in a bad light.

And getting people to understand meds are bad? Easier said than done. Some parents, a lot of them, just don't care what meds their kids are on since it "helps" the situation. Hyper children? Drop some ADD meds into the situation and don't bother me for a while, I'm watching Dancing with the Stars. Depressed? Pop a few pills and go back to your X Box, Daddy loves you, now go away. Sorry to say it like that, but we all know it's true.

And getting the general population to understand or pay attention otherwise? Not going to happen. It's easier to see a 30 second blip on the news and chose to believe what the talking heads tell them rather than actually do research on the subject. Joe Q Public doesn't care or doesn't listen when it comes to a school full of dead kids. They only believe what they hear during a 30 second sound bite.

Sorry to be the Debbie Downer in this situation, but there is no light at the end of the tunnel. Even if you had all the facts in the world, it's not going to be easy to combat the 24 hour news services blasting everyone with their agenda. Legislation will be passed. There will be no 10 year sunset like the last time. So called "assault weapons" and "military style rifles" (which coincidentally includes everything from trapdoor breech loading, bolt action, lever action and auto loading types) will be restricted or outright banned. Magazine limits will be back in play for pistols at the least and if rifles are not banned, for them as well. Expect riders to include mandatory reporting for large quantities of ammunition sold online, possible 4473 revisions to include potential mental health reviews for purchasing and mandatory waiting periods. And I can guarantee you one thing, opposition to this bill can and will be little to none. Nobody wants to take on the public perception right now.

I always tend to see your side of things brother, but this one just doesn't have a silver lining. And I'm off to dig a hole now.

[Grand58742]

However, even with saying that, here you go...

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-12-15/newtown-shooter-had-asperger-syndrome-and-some-us-gun-facts

http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp#[36]

http://westnet.com/~levins/guncontrol3.html

[Grand58742]

Unfortunately no references to back it up. However, should be able to keyword search and find some things.

http://lamarzulli.wordpress.com/

[Bearman202]

I got this link from another site:

http://gunwatch.blogspot.ch/2012/12/mass-killings-stopped-by-armed-citizens.html

[610Alpha]

I saw on Fox this morning that 38 of the mass shooters in the last 30 years had mental illness...it didn't give a link or anything like that.

I haven't looked at this link but it was in the Survival Doctors e-newsletter today:

http://www.thesurvivaldoctor.com/2012/12/18/school-violence-warning-signs/

[Maid Marion]

Meds or no meds a person would have to be mentally screwed up to go out an kill a bunch of people just for the he** of it. Not being diagnosed doesn't mean crap. It is an insane act.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

"Hard data" is hard to obtain because of HIPA laws, the same ones that make it hard to identify people who are crazy but "not a danger"

[qrprat77]

Yeah, HIPA is a double edged sword in this case. This link http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...n-newtown.html sez via an uncle that he was on psychotropic meds (Fanapt). Not a definate pill bottle with a name on it, but perhaps useful data.

[Patriotic Sheepdog]

I think you would have to look at the product insert for each med that they were on. Most of these drugs need to be tapered off over a long period of time depending on dosage and length of time the patient has been on it. When stopped abruptly, bad side effects can happen quickly.

It is being reported that the latest shooter, Adam Lanza, was possibly taking Fanapt which is a anti-psychotic med for schizophrenia. It does have a warning for suicide while taking it. It also list this as well;

Psychiatric Disorders: Frequent – restlessness, aggression, delusion; Infrequent – hostility, libido decreased, paranoia,
anorgasmia, confusional state, mania, catatonia, mood swings, panic attack, obsessive-compulsive disorder, bulimia
nervosa, delirium, polydipsia psychogenic, impulse-control disorder, major depression

Here is the product insert.

[1Admin]

Gracias everyone

Got this in email, can't vouch for the source though

The Real Deal:: "Dr Julian Whitaker Prozac (SSRIs) and Mass Murders"
GMcClure, 1 Caban (Earth) on Tzolkin calendar (17 d 2012 on gregorian calendar)
Prozac (serotonin inhibitors) taking youth goes berzerk and murders senselessly at public school. (Also Virginia Tech, etcetera.)
Serotonin inhibitors and mass murders (article http://curezone.com/forums/fm.asp?i=2016605)
SSRIs, or selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors, are the pharmaceutical companies latest cash cows. Their use has skyrocketed in the last ten years. Nicknamed "Chemical Babysitters" and designated anti depressants, they are causing dozens of murders, thousands of psychoses and are altering the minds of millions of users. All but a very few of the latest "Mass Murderers" have been on these drugs. Schools encourage parents to put their children on these drugs for the smallest signs of "non conformity". Schools receive more money for "disabled" students.
There are numerous examples of people who have gone off on a shooting rampage and killed their classmates, their co-workers, members of their family and often took their own lives, then it was shortly discovered that they were taking an antidepressant. The apparency is that the person was mentally ill and went on a rage but when these cases have actually been looked at closer, what we find is that the person did not have any violent tendencies and in most cases was not even suicidal before they started treatment with their antidepressant medication.
http://beforeitsnews.com/health/2012...n-2417899.html
Let’s take a look at what the manufacturers say about their own drugs in this class called antidepressants. I’m going to be reading here from package labels of various antidepressant medications. Now, the labeling is something that is required by the FDA, the wording of the labeling is “FDA Approved and Required.” Let’s take a look at what the FDA has required the manufacturers to reveal in their product labeling in their anti-depressant drugs regarding violence, homicide, and suicide.
I’m going to start by looking at the packaging insert for Prozac. Prozac is also known as fluoxitine. And here are some things that the manufacturer [Eli Lilly and Co.] themselves say about Prozac. One of the things that the manufacturer warns us and the FDA requires the manufacturer to let us know on the labels: These drugs can cause what is known as akathisia. Akathisia is a medical word that literally means “can’t sit still.” And it has two parts to it. The first part is what you can actually see in a person; the motor part of it, a person cannot sit still. They have restlessness, toe-tapping, shifting from leg to leg, pacing, in any case, they can’t sit still. They try to sit down or even to lie down and next thing you know, they’re hopping up again and they’re pacing, they look and act agitated. This [akathisia] is a straight-forward chemical effect of the drug.
The Scourge of Prozac by Dr. Julian Whitaker MD
When I first heard about the Columbine High School massacre, my initial thought was, "Lord help us, were they taking Prozac?" Nine days later, it was reported that Eric Harris, one of the shooters, was taking Luvox, which, like Prozac, Zoloft and Paxil, belongs to the class of drugs known as selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs). In one out of every 25 children taking it, Luvox causes mania, "a psychosis characterized by exalted feelings, delusions of grandeur…and overproduction of ideas."
Guns Are Blamed, but What About Prescription Drugs?
Likely due to pressure from the pharmaceutical industry-heavy advertisers in all media-the national debate on the epidemic of teen violence has ignored the widespread use of prescription drugs in teens and particularly those who have committed monstrous acts. However, the drug-violence link is frighteningly common. Fifteen-year-old Shawn Cooper of Notus, Idaho, fired a shotgun at students and school staff. According to his stepfather, he had been taking an SSRI. Thirteen-year-old Chris Fetters of Iowa killed her favorite aunt. She was taking Prozac. Kip Kinkel, a 15-year-old youth, went on a rampage in Oregon. He first shot and killed his parents, spent the night with the bodies (characteristic of the dissociative reaction these drugs often cause), then killed two and wounded 22 of his fellow students at Thurston High School. He was taking Prozac.
SSRI Drugs Can Turn People Into Monsters
Look, folks, these are the acts of monsters. The accessibility of guns and violent movies alone does not create monsters out of children. But prescription drugs that markedly alter brain chemistry can-and do! Particularly drugs like Prozac, which are, in my opinion, the chemical equivalent of a ghoulish Stephen King monster hiding in the closet. A few people have tried to warn the neighborhood, but no one is listening. And SSRIs don't backfire in children only. In November 1991, 66-year-old Barbara Mortenson attacked her 81-year-old mother, biting her more than 20 times and leaving chunks of flesh strewn on the floor. Barbara had been taking Prozac for the previous two weeks. Kristine Marie Cushing, age 39, had been separated from her husband for several months. In October 1991, she took a .38-caliber pistol and shot and killed both of her children, Elizabeth age 8, and Stephanie Marie, age 4, while they lay sleeping in their beds, then shot herself, inflicting a non-fatal wound. Prosecutors stated that they "couldn't find one iota of information to show that she was anything but a very giving, caring and sweet human being." After a plea of insanity, she was committed to a mental institution. What made her snap? She had been taking Prozac. Ann Blake Tracy, Ph.D., author of Prozac: Panacea or Pandora?, has been studying the violent, dark side of SSRI drugs for ten years. She has researched 32 murder/suicides that involved women and their children. By interviewing their families and studying autopsy reports, news accounts and medical histories, she has determined that in 24 of these 32 cases, the women were taking Prozac or another SSRI.
Revealing the Link: SSRIs and School Shootings
An in depth look at school shootings, and the commonly known side effects of SSRIs, reveals the drugs to be a primary factor leading to violence.
Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitors, or SSRIs, are commonly used to treat depression in children and adolescents. In 2005, the Center for Disease Control reported that 118 million prescriptions had been written for anti-depressants, and that the number of people using anti-depressants had “almost tripled between the periods 1988-1994 and 1999-2000”. One popular SSRI drug called Prozac has been prescribed to more than 38 million people worldwide.
As more and more people are given SSRIs to combat depression, mounting evidence suggests that the side effects of SSRIs can lead to violent behavior and suicide. Many of the high fatality school shootings of the past 10 years have involved shooters who had been prescribed SSRIs. An in depth look at school shootings, and the commonly known side effects of SSRIs, reveals the drugs to be a primary factor leading to violence.
Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitors work by altering the patient’s brain chemistry. Serotonin is a neurotransmitter that is released by one neuron to make another neuron fire, and is linked to mood and behavior. Serotonin is released into the space between neurons, called the synapse. In the natural course of events, the serotonin is then reabsorbed into the neuron it originally came from. SSRIs block this reuptake of the serotonin into the neuron. The idea is that with more serotonin in the synapse, the activity of the neurons will increase, which theoretically leads to better moods for some patients.
Unfortunately SSRIs can cause many different side effects. The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders IV is the most widely used source of diagnostic information for mental health by health professionals. It has “consistently confirmed that all anti-depressants can cause mania” which is a “potentially psychotic condition of intense mental and emotional excitement”. Mania often involves feelings of invulnerability, extreme power, farfetched and elaborate plans, as well as the urge to commit violence. A recent controlled clinical trial of the SSRI Prozac showed that it caused mania in six percent of the test subjects. Other side effects of Prozac include agitation, anxiety, instability, confusion, hallucinations, hostility and psychosis. Studies have also repeatedly shown an increased risk of suicide for people taking an SSRI.
http://beforeitsnews.com/health/2012...n-2417899.html

It Depends Upon Whose Children Are Murdered (commentary)
http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewr...es/128745.html
Posted by Bill Anderson on December 17, 2012 11:45 AM edited by GMcClure
The murder of 27 people, including 20 children, in Connecticut is utterly shocking and evil in every respect. Yet, many of the politicians who have demanded the president use all of his "powers" to impose punishment upon those who were innocent of this crime had no problem nearly 20 years ago when U.S. Government forces massacred 76 people, including 26 children, at Waco, and the horrific murders at Ruby Ridge Idaho just before.
People like Sen. Charles Schumer, one of the loudest voices calling for draconian gun control laws in the wake of the murders, also was one of the loudest voices defending the FBI for its role in the murder of the children at Waco. As many Democrats have told me, the people at Waco were "nut jobs," "wackos," and the like, so it really was OK that they were slaughtered. (Yes, I know there are a few Democrats who were horrified at what happened, but I don't know any personally, and I work in a place where almost everyone around me is a Democrat and a liberal Democrat at that.)
So, while people try to gain partisan advantage because of what happened Friday, we might remember that many of these same people would not care at all if a lot of other children were gunned down by government workers or immolated in fires the government officials deliberately set because, after all, their parents are "wackos."
- Bill Anderson

[SCinPNW]

Admin1, thank you for asking this question, and thank you to everyone for all of the information you have posted. For a very long time I have been of the opinion that these drugs are not good, and the little I had read at the time only confirmed that. All of the information that has been posted in this thread has cemented my opinion that these drugs are very very bad and should be taken off the market.

What is most frightening and shocking to me is how many people I personally know who take these medications and think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread. Now I ask myself, do I share this information with some of the people closest to me who I know to be taking these types of drugs? I want to, but am wondering how they will take it if I do. Something to think about.

Once again, thank you all for this information.

Merry Christmas!
SC

[MustangGal]

SC - good to see you posting! You have been in my thoughts and prayers.

I know my nephew has been prescribed a number of drugs - by general physicians - that, in my opinion, should only be prescribed by mental health professionals in very controlled conditions.

[SCinPNW]

MG, thank you for thinking of me. It is nice to know I have friends here thinking of me. :-)

I know what you mean about the concerns of having general physicians prescribing these drugs, unfortunately, that seems to be the norm. The first link that Triple-Sod posted about psychiatric drugs and school violence was particularly interesting to me. It really confirmed my concerns for these types of drugs, and what bothers me the most is that my husband and I have family members who are on these medications and all they too only had to ask their doctor for them. They praise these medications to the high heavens! In fact, when I was lamenting our recent election results with one particular family member they suggested I call up my doctor so that I too could get my own prescription. I then explained to said person that I did not believe in these drugs and the conversation ended. I really want to send that link and the other info posted in this thread to our family members, but my dh asked me not to so I will not out of respect for dh.

As it has been stated, what happened last Friday is horrific beyond words, but the fact that the powers that be are only looking to put a bandaid on the problem rather than peeling back the layers in an effort to find the true problem, which very well maybe these medications is even more disturbing in my mind.

Truly, all I can do is pray for our country and for this World.

Peace and Blessings!
SC