Not that I'm wishing for a 'Societal Correction Event'...

[Knobster]

(Bit of a rant here)
So I collapse into bed last night around ten since my alarm clock goes off at 0-dark thirty and I can hear my neighbor and two of his buddies drinking and laughing in his driveway. Great guy, friendly, our kids and theirs have fun playing with each other etc etc etc. As I'm laying there trying to fall asleep I can't help but think back to what I spent the past 5 hours doing vs what he was doing. While he was slamming down beers and joking with his buddies I logged another hour of overtime at work; took inventory of my supplies; ordered some replacement gear for camping; washed, rinsed and filled a couple of 2-liter bottles with water; researched 'Interarms 30-06' on the web as I saw one for sale but have never heard of that vendor; and the list goes on.

Like my title says, I'm not wishing for a huge crash as it would be horrible for everyone, but there are times I wish just a little bit of hardship would hit these sheeple so they would wake up! My neighbor has a generator so he can run the fridge in his garage that is full of beer in case of a power outage, the other guys (also neighbors) he was hanging out with seem like they never quite grew up from their college years. I know that if TS ever HTF, these guys are going to panic and a very small part of me can't wait to smirk and tell these guys "should have prepped like I did".

Ugh. Rant off. Thanks for letting me blow off some steam. I guess I'm just tired as I got one less hour of sleep last night.

[1Admin]

Ant and Grasshopper(s). People like this unfortunately never learn.

Pack 4 buckets of rice for them. Label them "4 of 8", "5 of 8" "6 of 8", etc.

When you give them to them (when something happens, not now), explain that you wish you could do more, on a whim you put up 8 buckets of this stuff years ago. We love your kids, blah blah blah, we don't want to see them suffer blah blah blah.

Yes you could tell them to screw off, dance to the tune you danced to in the summer, etc. (Ant and Grasshopper). But realistically as selfish and irresponsible people are today- you would just be making him your enemy.

By giving him a little bit of food- in his mind possibly HALF of what you have, now you are bringing him CLOSER to your level. Before he was just another dumbbutt surbanite who would not fight to defend his overpriced and mortgaged to the hilt McMansion and now worthless 98" flat screen. NOW he has something to defend, as you do.

Now (then) he has something to KEEP QUIET about also. He's in more or less the same boat you are in. He has food, you have food.

If he lives close enough to keep you up at night, you need to have a little food for him.

That's not the "Rambo" response- i.e, kill everyone that looks at me sideways in the PAW. But it's the most realistic one. Don't ever SAY that's not all your food, but don't turn around and start BBQ'ing steaks right afterwards either. Lose a couple lbs, don't shave for a while and look the part.

Is it a risk? You bet it is. However it's a risk just being there with them. This is lessening your risk.

I'd like to hear what people think about this strategy versus the "kill everyone that comes" aka Rambo response.

Robert

[Mikeg175]

I've been wondering the same thing about my response to this situation . I get the weird looks and the jokes from family members . I have decided that those for those who I have explained what I do and they laugh , they are zombies . If my neighbors are the decent sort then maybe slap them something to keep the edge off . I can't live with looking everywhere at once and making nice with an idiot neighbor who can watch/warn my back or side , will be worth a bucket or three . The only problem with that would be him/her going hmm , they gave that up too easy , they must have loads stashed and they owe me more .
I have thought a few scenario's , one I act like the masses . I get my neighbor to come along with me as protection , we go to the stores , fight the masses , let him see us struggle to get something . Then he goes wow we need to stick together , this is terrible . I go back eat and lose weight a little slower then them . Another same scenario , I realize this guy may not have prepped , but he does have his SH@@ together and doesn't panic , keeps his cool , then maybe I share with him a little . Another one , I sit on the porch and let them know it was nice knowing you , now get lost . I think it has to be somewhere in between , just to keep a semi safe option behind or near you .
I really can't give an honest opinion about it , except to know how I will treat the few people who know what I have been doing and laugh/joke about it .

[crossbow]

hopefully, your kids will follow your footsteps,habits and not your neighbors

[Knobster]

Great comments. I live in your typical suburban neighborhood surrounded by good people. They just have wool firmly placed over their eyes. Making enemies would not be wise as I would quickly be out-manned. Besides, there are too many young children involved that would be hard to watch suffer. I do like the 'make them join me for a food/water run and fight for it'. Hadn't thought of that...

[610Alpha]

I may have to do a FMEA or Pugh chart to properly analyze the risks/options...ah heck I might as well launch a whole 6 Sigma project to properly evaluate.... just a little humor.

@1Admin - the problem with the Rambo approach is that you put a big target on your back....the zombies are attracted to noise and could very easily over run you. On the other hand you can't prepare for everyone in your neighborhood, so you have to do a preliminary triage of who you think might have a half a brain. You also have to consider is this for TSHTF or just a recession/depression. This will have some impact, will they even be around in the event or will they leave like on the History channel flu epidemic. Depression type event they might stick around or might not. I guess my point is get to know your neighbors well enough to find out where their family is from and how close they are to them. If they are close to their family they will have a higher probability of going to them if the event happens. If it is a recession/depression they may or may not go.

[tarheelsman71]

Elittle, I am a greenbelt if you want to get that project under way. :)

My thoughts on this are simple. I have too big a heart, so my plan is to leave to my retreat location (remote as we could find) as soon as people start to see that the shelves at the store are empty. I spent around $500 buck so far for staples, beans, Rice and canned goods specifically for those that I leave behind. When they come to me (especially those close enough to me to know that I have food), I plan to be gone. and they can have that food. While I know that I could use that food at the retreat, that food gives me a little bit of comfort that I tried to do for those that didnt/wouldnt do for themselves. Call it charity, or a guilty conscience, but even though I have tried to steer them into a preppers mindset and they have refused to accept that reality, I still think of it as a failure on my part. Having my eyes opened to their rationale, and reasoning out what that means for their future was a tough pill to swallow. I can leave knowing that I tried to help out. My brother in law is a hell of a carpenter, and he would be a great help at the retreat, but his refusal to help himself is a nail I wont put in his coffin. His response to how he feeds his family if the SHTF...I will just deer hunt. I have come to terms that you just cant fix stupid. It is a shame that he has 3 lovely children that he cares so little about. I guess the food is more for those little kids then it is for him.

[becky3086]

I am not sure that I would say someone doesn't care about their children just because they don't believe what you believe. It is very possible that nothing will ever happen and you will be the one who has done all this work for nothing and your children may never believe in what you believe either so they may never become preppers themselves. You just never know. I frankly think it is the people who can't see other people's point of view and can't change and adjust to a changing environment are the ones who are going to have the most problem.

[Knobster]

elittle and tarheelsman71,
Let's get a project charter going first, then we'll tackle a VOC matrix!

If a true SHTF scenario were to hit I imagine most of my neighbors would bug out as they all have family within a 2-5 hour drive. The closest family we have is 8 hours away which would include a drive through the south side of Chicago - not gonna happen! However, I'm convinced that 'the event' will be a slow slide into a deep depression so most will stick around for awhile.

I'm going to pick up some pool shock this afternoon and put the container (along with instructions and plenty of zip-lock bags) into a sealed bucket so I'll be able to dole out ways to treat many gallons of water for everyone. At least we'll all have water to drink from the 3 nearby ponds...

[Matt In Oklahoma]

I'm going to pick up some pool shock this afternoon and put the container (along with instructions and plenty of zip-lock bags) into a sealed bucket so I'll be able to dole out ways to treat many gallons of water for everyone. At least we'll all have water to drink from the 3 nearby ponds...

Have you ever actually used pool shock? I asked this a while back not only here but in several other places and even directly to several people I know who also store it and no one had actually used it, so this question isn just for Knobster, I'm curious and want to hear from anyone who has really used it and drank the water for a period of time.

[manowar]

i always talk about evolving, cuz i am always evolving.
i grew up in the states, mostly ohio texas and arizona, i thought the southwest was the place to hunker down, but the more i got to thinking about water the more i thought about northern ontario, i had an opportunity 10 yrs ago to move here and 4 yrs ago i was able to purchase an 80 acre homestead, great place to have lots of food cashes.
now as to my neighbors, such as they are, most around here are farmers, slash and burn the forest clear some farm land and off ya go, which i like
now that being said, i am also 300 hundred miles north of toronto and the golden horseshoe-estimated 5 million people- how many of those will move north in search of food? don't know but i do know it will be too many.
So back in the day in my mighty warrior 20's i was a rambo type-bug out evade and escape and killem all let god sort them out type of guy. now bug in connect with my neighbors and help out the less fortunate.
heres the way i see it- you are basically a good guy, but did not prepare by self or with a family, your tired scared and hungry, i offer you shelter, hot meal and a safe place for the night, while sizing you up, now i might hand you 3 days worth of food or i might offer you to stay , learn and help me thrive and protect what i have.
i focus on food very heavily as you might have noticed by now, but i like to eat, i can tough out any situation, but food is fuel and the future so i focus mostly on how to get it ,save it prepare it store it.
manowar

[Hidden Agenda]

Ant and Grasshopper(s).

I'd like to hear what people think about this strategy versus the "kill everyone that comes" aka Rambo response.

Robert

With proper planning, I think that this plan has far more merit than the "Rambo" approach.

1The only problem with that would be him/her going hmm , they gave that up too easy , they must have loads stashed and they owe me more .
2I have thought a few scenario's , one I act like the masses . I get my neighbor to come along with me as protection , we go to the stores , fight the masses , let him see us struggle to get something . Then he goes wow we need to stick together , this is terrible . I go back eat and lose weight a little slower then them . Another same scenario , I realize this guy may not have prepped , but he does have his SH@@ together and doesn't panic , keeps his cool , then maybe I share with him a little . Another one , I sit on the porch and let them know it was nice knowing you , now get lost . I think it has to be somewhere in between , just to keep a semi safe option behind or near you .

Above enumeration by me for response purposes)...1 The longer you wait to give it to them, the more appreciative they are likely to be (in theory). If you really look (and smell) the part when you do, it will likely increase the odds in your favor. 2 This is also a great example of psy-ops, which (in my opinion) will play a greater role in the PAW than the "Rambo" approach. By taking him along on a supply acquisition mission and letting him experience what it will take to survive in the PAW, you allow him to come to his own conclusions. Furthermore, if approached by you from a "Hey buddy, I'm gonna make a supply run and could use your help" angle, you would thereby be allowing him to feel empowered that it was "his" decision-making skills and rational (potentially) put him into an alliance/MAG with you...not his weakness and inability to provide. This could make a significant difference in things.

It really does come down to personalities, and the more you know about your neighbors....the better.

[protus]

Have you ever actually used pool shock? I asked this a while back not only here but in several other places and even directly to several people I know who also store it and no one had actually used it, so this question isn just for Knobster, I'm curious and want to hear from anyone who has really used it and drank the water for a period of time.

but yet everyone on the web says to store it for water, but when asked if they have tested it ( aka made a batch of water to drink) none have.

People need to test and use what they read on the web. We all cry "sheep" when it comes to noisey nieghbors, or people who do "get it". If you blindly follow what you read on the web, your no different. Your just following the masses of lemers(sp) going off the cliff. Just sheep with a bunch of stuff. nothing more.


becky-
As a father, my child was my main reason why i progressed my preperations past a BOB and a bunch of guns. Sure i had supplys for a few weeks even a month for 2. But untill daddydom befell me, i wasnt serious. As the head of my house it is my responsibilty to protect and provide for my family. Should my kid feel the same right now at age 5. No , i dont expect she will. but maybe, when she is my age she will have the same drive to do the same for her family. My parents were not survivalist by any means, but the idea to be self reliant , and be responsible for myself was installed from an early age. Even is she does nothing but put away a small amount is will be better off than most.
As to others, I feel if you have a family its your job to protect and provide for them,if you see a hurricane coming and all you do is plop a side or ribs on the BBQ and open a cold one, while you let your kid be the human kite with a bed sheet in the wind... vs going to the safe room in your house and hunkering down to stay safe....your not careing.
SHTF is not just about some end all mad max wet dream. A broken leg, keeping you from work, canes, tornados, qaukes, even a simple slip in bath tub......could all be life changing shtfe events. Being closeminded that only ONE of those things could be it, will set the survivalist up for failure.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

but yet everyone on the web says to store it for water, but when asked if they have tested it ( aka made a batch of water to drink) none have.
People need to test and use what they read on the web. We all cry "sheep" when it comes to noisey nieghbors, or people who do "get it". If you blindly follow what you read on the web, your no different. Your just following the masses of lemers(sp) going off the cliff. Just sheep with a bunch of stuff. nothing more

Exactly!

https://www.survivalandpreparednessforum.com/showthread.php?1335-Who-Has-actually-Used-Pool-Shocked-Water-To-Drink&highlight=pool

but if anyone ever bellies up to the bar let us know. I'm not saying it can't be done but I just have real concerns about that chemical treatment and it's one of the reasons i have gone to the option of building cheap filters to distribute around in "places". And yes I have tested them, slow but effective. To speed them up more filters per bucket can be used or multiple homemade filters which is my option because it's more efficient in rain collection etc.

[protus]

Exactly!

https://www.survivalandpreparednessforum.com/showthread.php?1335-Who-Has-actually-Used-Pool-Shocked-Water-To-Drink&highlight=pool

but if anyone ever bellies up to the bar let us know. I'm not saying it can't be done but I just have real concerns about that chemical treatment and it's one of the reasons i have gone to the option of building cheap filters to distribute around in "places". And yes I have tested them, slow but effective. To speed them up more filters per bucket can be used or multiple homemade filters which is my option because it's more efficient in rain collection etc.

just not here matt.
Many forums, and not just with pool shock.
Look how many people come up with off the wall food storge info, when none have packed any or even eaten their prep foods for any extended time.
How many here have purchased FD foods, but lived off them for a week.

Using your gear and your body you start to learn some really valuable things. Those things you learn could save your life.

I remeber long time ago...in forum far far away. There was this guy. So many people swore you had to xyz cook sets to cook any food from your BOB..so that guy cooked about 20 meals ranging from eggs and biscuts w/gravy to tree rat in a canteen cup and some basic BOB stoves. Later,that same guy lived off his short term food preps.

Who has done that? 3 days?8 days ?10 days?

When i did my shortterm food experiment, it consisted of all the foods you see people say they have-
ramen-check
grits-check
canned soup- check
canned meats- check
oatmeal- check
water-check

of course other items were there, but it was all placed in a small container and that was what i lived off of for 5 days.no extras
it sucked.
I wanted /craved "real" food so bad by the end of the week.
It wasnt becuase of diversity, trust me...lot of those "canteen cup" meals were done with what was in that list of prep foods. But it was done with the foods so many say/founded their food preps on while saying how much they had. It sucked. but i learned something from it.
but how many people actually do it...
how many have tried to live off mainstay bars for "3 days:" with nothing but water...anyone????
How many have actaully humped their bug out bag for farther than 5 miles over xx amount of days?
How many have actually practiced /trained off the static line?
How many have you seen plug gear, that is new and untested only because its free swag or its a name brand and no other reason......

yet everyone will recommend a means that they have not tested.....

if anything...folks, take from my slight de-reail. that unless you have actually tried it, dont count on it to save your 6 when the time comes.
ymmv