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  • Emergency plans in Louisville raise eyebrows

    Council members express concern over sanctity of private property rights
    By John Aguilar Camera Staff Writer
    Posted: 03/23/2011 05:15:45 PM MDT

    Language in Louisville's proposed emergency response plan, which would give the city the power to "commandeer private property" and "seize" buildings in a crisis, has given several of the city's elected leaders pause.

    The emergency ordinance, which was supposed to have gotten an up or down vote earlier this month, was instead tabled until April so that the council can figure out how it wants to deal with what one member called the measure's "stark" language.

    "I think any time you talk about government seizing private property -- that's not something I'm comfortable with," Councilman Bob Muckle said Tuesday.

    Muckle said he understood that in extraordinary circumstances, extraordinary measures must be taken, but he said he wants to hear from the police chief and other city staff on exactly how they envision implementing Louisville's emergency measures.

    The subject of municipal crisis management has taken on a special urgency in the wake of Japan's earthquake and tsunami and the resulting nuclear and humanitarian crises.

    While Councilman Hank Dalton said it's unlikely Louisville will ever experience a crisis on the scale of what struck Japan or New Orleans during Hurricane Katrina, it's important to enact policy that is crystal clear to the citizenry.

    "It's just a sensitivity about what Louisville residents are going to see when they see it," he said. "If you just have the stark language without the context, you don't get that understanding."

    In large part, the city's proposed ordinance is fairly straightforward.

    It directs the mayor to declare a disaster emergency if the threat of severe damage, injury or loss of life is imminent as the result of a flood, fire, earthquake, storm, hazardous substance spill, civil disturbance, drought, blight or invasion -- among other calamities.

    It lays out a line of succession in city government should anyone become incapacitated, allows the city to shut down roads, compel an evacuation and establish a curfew.

    In fact, said Louisville Police Chief Bruce Goodman, much of the language was taken from ordinances in other places.

    That includes Boulder, which updated its emergency response plan in 2009. Its protocols also give the city the power to "commandeer or use any private property," but doesn't assign it the right to seize anything.

    Goodman, who has been pushing Louisville to adopt an emergency preparedness plan for several years, said he understands how some of the draconian language in the ordinance raises "red flags," including a section that empowers city officials to "seize any food, clothing, water or medical supplies necessary to sustain displaced disaster victims."

    But he said the real life examples of a temporary takeover of property during an emergency are a lot milder than what the words connote.

    "It can be as minor as using a piece of land to park emergency vehicles," Goodman said.

    During forest fires, he said, helicopters have filled up buckets from private water sources. In the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, the federal government commandeered buses to move victims out of the danger zone.

    The ordinance calls for the city to reimburse anyone for property taken during a crisis.

    "I think in those terms, people understand it," Goodman said.

    Judd Golden, chairman of the Boulder chapter of the ACLU, said Louisville has the right and responsibility to prepare itself for a possible disaster. But the ordinance should be open to judicial review in case the city overreaches.

    "The government needs to have power, but it doesn't need to have unchecked power," he said. "This can be done in a way that eliminates the potential for abuse."

    Louisville Mayor Chuck Sisk agreed, saying that the language in the proposed ordinance caused him immediate concern. He said he will be asking questions of staff next month as to whether the city even needs an emergency preparedness plan or whether what's in place now is sufficient.

    "Any time you do something like this, there has to be balancing involved," the mayor said. "I want to make sure we're proactive, but I also want to make sure we're being reasonable."

    Read more: Emergency plans in Louisville raise eyebrows - Boulder Daily Camera http://www.dailycamera.com/news/ci_1...#ixzz1HjblDNOz
    DailyCamera.com


    Language in Louisville’s proposed emergency response plan, which would give the city the power to “commandeer private property” and “seize” buildings in a crisis, has …



    Thoughts?
    You know what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like this?

  • #2
    Wow politicians protecting rights! It really is the end isnt it! LOL
    Knowledge is Power, Practiced Knowledge is Strength, Tested Knowledge is Confidence

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    • #3
      Thats crazy, but with the police backing it what can ya do. Tellem' no would probably get ya tossed in the pokey and forgotten about.

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      • #4
        Barricade your drive if you live in the boonies?
        OPSEC would have your driveway semi-hidden or hidden if you live in the boonies.

        I don't know, I am a compassionate man, but I know the government will only screw you.
        Horror stories of people who helped Katrina victims by letting them into their houses only to find items stolen and their property damaged, with NO compensation from the government.

        I also think our forefathers rolled over in their graves when the supreme court ruled that the government can take private property for the soul purpose to give it to another private party who promises to increase the tax value of the land.

        America is slowly dying from liberals and democrats.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by WiseOwl View Post
          Goodman, who has been pushing Louisville to adopt an emergency preparedness plan for several years, said he understands how some of the draconian language in the ordinance raises "red flags," including a section that empowers city officials to "seize any food, clothing, water or medical supplies necessary to sustain displaced disaster victims."
          Let me get this right. The city of Louisville's disaster plan is to care for the victims with seized food, clothing, water & medical supplies that they've stolen from it's citizenry!? And the folks are okay with this?! Really? That seems like a really good way to find yourself on the business end of a gun.

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          • #6
            property rights are already being disregarded as more localities use eminent domain to get there hands on properties, which can then be used by an entity such as Wal Mart, in order to increase tax revenue. The freedoms get chipped away, bit by bit.

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            • #7
              After the Katrina fiasco FEMA was given the power to confiscate, from private citizens, any food or supplies they deem necessary, as long as they leave you a three day supply.
              OK, so you think you are going to send them away at gunpoint? Look for them to leave and a SWAT team to arive in their place. You will lose either way. Either your food or your life will be lost.
              Tell NO ONE about your preps, and do not buy from places like Costco or Sams that keep detailed records of your purchases. I do not use those so called "reward cards" at the supermarket either, for the same reason.
              I do not preach to people at work, or anywhere else about prepping.
              "There is nothing so exhilarating as to be shot at without result." Winston Churchill
              Member: Veterans of Foreign Wars, Vietnam Veterans of America, American Legion, AMVETS, Society of the Fifth Infantry Division

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              • #8
                rice paddy daddy - how do you mean Costco and Sams keeps records? Because you have to use your card and that is recorded, or is there more to it I don't realize? I guess it would figure they would come take all your preps. You work hard and earn a living and they take all your money to give to others who don't do sh!t. Why not take your food away to give to others as well. Maybe it's time to get a BOL in New Zealand or something. What a total bunch of Sh!t. I could see that happening for sure in this day and age.

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                • #9
                  This keeps popping into my head and I don't know why. Does it seem familiar to anyone else? It's something about not being deprived of life, liberty, or property without due process of law. I don't know why that came to mind. HMMmm. Must not be important.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Bull View Post
                    It's something about not being deprived of life, liberty, or property without due process of law. I don't know why that came to mind. HMMmm. Must not be important.
                    I LOVE IT!! Great reply Bull!

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Bull View Post
                      rice paddy daddy - how do you mean Costco and Sams keeps records? Because you have to use your card and that is recorded, or is there more to it I don't realize?
                      Yes, each item you purchase on a particular transaction is tied to your specific member card and goes into the data base of all your transactions. Assuming the disaster is local and the electric grid is not down over the whole country, it would be easy for FEMA to search Costco or Sams database by entering the SKU for rice, as an example, and further search by quantities, and find out who in the locality in question has bought large quantities.
                      Ain't computers grand?
                      "There is nothing so exhilarating as to be shot at without result." Winston Churchill
                      Member: Veterans of Foreign Wars, Vietnam Veterans of America, American Legion, AMVETS, Society of the Fifth Infantry Division

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        That is true.

                        However, I do not plan on keeping all my preps in the same place that my membership is registered.
                        "Fate rarely calls upon us at a moment of our choosing"- Optimus Prime

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                        • #13
                          My attempt at a poem:

                          Who's that knocking on my door, well its Johny law and he's come to take more. Please don't take my rice and beans I say with a gasp and that is when he hit me with a asp (an Asp is a baton). As I lay on the floor and think some more about the situation of him walking out the door. I prepped for many years and and now it is gone, The feds ate my beans and before long, I will get off this floor and ring the freedom bell and tell the feds to go to hell. They can take my beans and take my rice but the feds will never take my life. The tree of freedom will be refreshed and new once the American public stands by you. To the Feds I say this one quote, Treat us nice and we will treat you better, but take our rice, land, guns or more, and you will find yourself on the floor.
                          When an emergency is upon you the time for preparation has past.

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