Rifles

[biathlon]

For me practice is the single most important aspect of being prepared with my rifle. I am a big fan of the 308/7.62 nato primarily because I can practice all day without developing a flinch. Massive amounts of proven load data and tons of surplus brass and projectiles.

[ssonb]

I have owned,shot and reloaded many a rifle and I will agree with MIO, each must choose the cal. and rifle that fits and shoots for them the best. As I get older I am tending to sell off certain rifles to reduce my "balistic footprint". The wife loves her Mini 14 but I am working twards an AR 10 in 308 platform, for me that seems to be the best in a lot of shooting worlds,( Mag cap, accuracy, recoil, reloadble, cover to concealment conversion, short and long range power.) First you must own a rifle and shoot it , that is the logistic problem ,after that it is a matter of Taticts.

[jojo64155]

I don't hunt, but I have been the hunted. I'm not going to attempt a shot at a thousand yards, heck I'll just slip away and get 'em from ambush (if it ever comes to that).
But I argree with your premise, that there are too many people who think they, and their weapon, are better than they really are. Me? I'm 62, slow and old, and no longer have the eyesight of a 19 year old soldier. I know what I'm capable of and what my limitations are.
Long ago and far away I learned that if you go looking for trouble you will probably find it. I prefer not to.

Very well put.

[Buster]

over estimating your ability will get you into trouble that you can't talk your way out of

[Matt In Oklahoma]

I don't hunt, but I have been the hunted. I'm not going to attempt a shot at a thousand yards, heck I'll just slip away and get 'em from ambush (if it ever comes to that).
But I argree with your premise, that there are too many people who think they, and their weapon, are better than they really are. Me? I'm 62, slow and old, and no longer have the eyesight of a 19 year old soldier. I know what I'm capable of and what my limitations are.
Long ago and far away I learned that if you go looking for trouble you will probably find it. I prefer not to.

And you are a wise man!

[rice paddy daddy]

I don't hunt, but I have been the hunted. I'm not going to attempt a shot at a thousand yards, heck I'll just slip away and get 'em from ambush (if it ever comes to that).
But I argree with your premise, that there are too many people who think they, and their weapon, are better than they really are. Me? I'm 62, slow and old, and no longer have the eyesight of a 19 year old soldier. I know what I'm capable of and what my limitations are.
Long ago and far away I learned that if you go looking for trouble you will probably find it. I prefer not to.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

For those who chose to carry the 223/5.56 and have little or no experience you can still do homework without the high cost of materials and ammo. These are some decent sights and most have other calibers availible as well. There are other sites and as and with all info "on the net" take it with a grain of salt and not as gospel, as they say on tv "results may vary". I also encourage each of you to take your desired weapon and hunt with it so you can see what works and how well. I know alot on here don't/won't hunt but it is as close as you can get to know your weapon without taking a human life.

http://stevespages.com/page8f.htm

http://stevespages.com/page8f223remington.html

http://stevespages.com/pdf/5_56mm_military_info.pdf

http://www.theboxotruth.com/

[610Alpha]

The farthest shot I made was at one of those pop up targets in basic, 300 m or 325 yards. I have not had the opportunity to shoot an animal at that distance, stinking trees are everywhere and all the deer are hiding in the little nooks and crannies of corn fields that you don't get to see them that far away, at least where I live.

Thanks for the link and good topic/discussion.

[Matt In Oklahoma]

"specialty ammo" is probably a 77gr sierra match king load.

[Klayton]

Hot Damn Matt! Just found a thread online saying their is a 1,200 yd confirmed kill with a 5.56mm!!! But they used specialty ammo, whatever the hell that is.

(((Damn I hate nights I cannot sleep)))

[Klayton]

Well, I am no "bragger" that is for sure. My longest shot was in the military during my semi-annual qualification, 350m (which is about 380 yds I believe). Longest kill shot, guessing here, was maybe 150 yards across a corn field hitting a white tail buck. A 6 pointer (again, I don't brag-makeup- huge "fish tales" LOL)...

[Matt In Oklahoma]

"I am imagining at 700yds a stack of thick clothing would all but stop it???" I wouldnt want to be the one to try that. I have seen more than a few things drop at distances with this and other rounds. While the round is not impresive at distance in Afganistan/Iraq there are quit a few testimonials to it still killing.

"Next question, are you planing to have that large of a distance between you and the bad guy? I mean, unless I am on the farm I cannot see worrying about making any shot greater than 100yds... "
I covered that in saying Post SHTF I'm not sure at 1000yds it might be best to be quiet. I know where some of you live, 800 yds is not gonna happen unless your shooting down the highway. LOL

"May I suggest to wait until the "target" is at a much more realistic range and you are able to better determine the "target's" intention? Would suck if you find out after words you killed a surviving doctor who was just looking for berries to eat."
I totally agree with you. I don't engage at long ranges unless otherwise find myself engaged or need the meat real bad while hunting.

My main point in my ramblings is don't underestimate calibers and the folks behind them just because you are a man's man and shoot the newest and biggest. You make several valid points on several things and I am glad to see the thinking which is more than those I wrote the post about with their false bravado and sad attempts to make folks feel bad about their rifle.

[Klayton]

[QUOTE=Matt In Oklahoma;4919] If I shoot someone in the chest at 700 yds with 5.56 ball they will cease to become an immediate threat because they are treating a sucking chest wound at which time I will use the backdoor and leave or indian up and finish them. [QUOTE]

Hmmm not sure what 5.56 round you are firing, but at 500yds a 5.56 has between 300-400 ft/lb of energy left (depending on the source you want to believe). This compared to the muzzle energy of roughly 1300 ft/lbs (again depending on your source). No source lists anything (that I can find) of 5.56 ballistics past 500yds... I am imagining at 700yds a stack of thick clothing would all but stop it???

Next question, are you planing to have that large of a distance between you and the bad guy? I mean, unless I am on the farm I cannot see worrying about making any shot greater than 100yds... Don't forget, firing a shot always gives away your general location, and firing two shots locks in your position. =(

May I suggest to wait until the "target" is at a much more realistic range and you are able to better determine the "target's" intention? Would suck if you find out after words you killed a surviving doctor who was just looking for berries to eat. =)

[M4Shadow]

As an ex-army ranger, there is a lot of truth in what you are saying. People do need to know their limitations of their of their Bullet, Riffle and skill, you get a lot of desktop survivalist who play a lot of video games who think they can make a thousand yard shot, they might be able to do it in the game but they can't do it in real life without skill, training and practice, then you have to add in natural variables. Its not as easy as some people think it is. And on top of that there isn't a lot of places where you can practice a shot like that.

I do a lot of hunting, i have no problem taking white-tail deer out to 300-600 yards with my 308 the longest range I can remember killing a deer is little over 700 yards. I target shoot a lot too. I would love to see people who don't do this that often to try to make that thousand yard shot. Under ideal conditions it is a lot tougher than people think it is.

Great post!

[EX121]

Well written. Where I live and hunt, shrub-steppe of eastern washington, you can sometimes see game for a mile or more across the canyons. I 'hear' of many folks shooting 6-800 yards. But a couple of years ago I bought a rangefinder and was amazed at how much I had been over-estimating the yardage, after 200 yards. I was very good out to 200, I guess it's easy to estimate 2 football fields. But when it came to guessing distance steeply up hill or downhill I would guess it at 500 and it would be 300. And to echo Matt, I hear guys say "OH I only need one shot at 25 yards to sight in, just to make sure it still on from last year". As he says shoot often and at the range you think you will be using during a hunt, how else will you know what you are capable of.